Cultural Backlash: An Open Post

[causticus]

There were some interesting discussions on yesterday's Magic Monday post and on the past month's or so posts on the Ecosophia blog regarding the collapse of alternative spirituality in the West and a likely impending cultural backlash against decades of general rot and grubbiness that is decaying our civilization from within.

Some of us here in the US are afraid that a sudden cultural jolt in the other direction, away from leftism/progressivism, will result in any type of spirituality that doesn't fit a narrow, literalist Christian/Abrahamic format as being seen by the reaction mob as "part of the problem." Anything the people leading and directing this backlash deem to be adjacent to the aforementioned cultural rot will be lazily lumped together into one big, bad conspiracy against what they believe they are trying to save and preserve. This likely means anything occult/esoteric, overtly pagan, or too foreign will be included, with very little nuance. As we know, the moral collapse of both Neopaganism and the postmodern occult scene hasn't helped matters at all in this respect, especially in light of recent tragic events.

Anyway, I want to know what anyone else here thinks of this and anything in your own area (US or somewhere else) you have seen indicative of a new cultural direction that may or or may not involve the condemnation of the things I listed above (or anything else that comes to mind). Also, we could use this space to think up ideas on how to preserve and carry on various spiritual teachings and practices if/when an intolerant religious climate becomes reality.

This is an open post that will stay open for quite a long time.

Comments

[jprussell]

Pretty much agreed on all points! As a Heathen, I stopped thinking of myself or calling myself a "pagan" or "neopagan" pretty much as soon as I got serious about believing the Gods are actual, separate beings, and not just archetypes of the deep mind or whatever (I went through that phase for a bit and was more-or-less happy to see Heathenry as just another flavor of neopaganism. Luckily, more serious Heathens had already been distancing themselves, so when I got there, I wasn't off on my own).

Also, for what it's worth, while I've not yet found any in-person groups to get involved with, I read the Norse myths to my girls, pray with the older one and plan to do so with the younger one when she's old enough, and openly talk with them about what I believe, how it differs from what others believe, and why those differences have led me to where I am, but I'm not otherwise "out" as a polytheist, except online, obviously. I'm comfortable sharing under my name here because I'm not ashamed of my beliefs and don't do anything to give normies the creeps, so if it "comes out," I'd be like "why yes, I do worship the Germanic Gods, what of it?" But in the meantime, it's easier to mostly fly under the radar.

One other thought on the child-unfriendliness of the Neopagan scene. As JMG has pointed out, during its heyday, the Neopagan/Wiccan scene was quite intentionally libertine, with lots of casual sex and alternative lifestyles, so it makes sense that the folks who came up in that wouldn't want kids around (at least, I'd hope they don't), but it is also a big part of why so little of the Neopagan scene created anything with roots and is now mostly the same people that came for the casual sex in the 80s and 90s, but didn't drift away for one reason or another. In the city where I live there's a "Pagans Night Out" that meets for drinks once a month, and checking their facebook page, it's all middle-aged or older folks.

Oh, and more in response to your follow on comment, good luck with your project! As you say, we need more sensible alternative spirituality options that are distinct enough from the sinking Neopagan ship to not get sucked down with it!

Cheers,
Jeff

[alexanderthered]

Thanks for jumping in, I really appreciate your feedback!

It's tough out there for neopagans / practitioners of alternative spiritualities who are looking for a community or group to meet up with off of the internet.

After I had my spiritual experience a couple of years ago, I spent some time looking for groups to meet up with in the hopes of finding like-minded people and finding answers, and my experience was pretty negative. Tell neopagan folks that you had a bona-fide spiritual experience as a normal / not special person (something that used to be more commonplace, by the way!) and dare I say you might as well label many of these people as atheists - the idea that someone would have some kind of spiritual experience completely baffled most of them, with a few even suggesting mental illness. Combine that with the visible grimace when I lightly mentioned having a kid and wanting to involve them in some way in the future, and it was obvious that these groups were going to be a no-go.

This genuinely surprised me at the time. What kind of spiritual movement doesn't believe in spiritual experiences? At least the Christians I talked to believed me - most interpreted it as either some temptation from Satan and something to just let go / move on from, or something from the Virgin Mary (apparently the rabbit is a symbol of Mary in Catholicism) - but at least they believed me and offered help /guidance if I needed it.

As for sharing with my daughter - she's not quite big enough to get deeply involved in things yet, but as my beliefs revolve around animism, I've been sharing my animist view of the world with her and encouraging her to have a healthy relationship with the spirits of nature, with the occasional dabbling with the energies of nature / natural magic. I'm open with my beliefs and practices with her and she's been very receptive to it. My wife has been receptive and very supportive as well.

I have no idea if my project is going to actually achieve anything or catch on, but I feel that it is something vitally important for the larger culture and society. At the same time, I feel that it is a lifetime work, and so I'm not in a huge rush to get it out there (and even if I did, modern society makes it very difficult to do so if you do not intend to grift people out of their hard earned money) - I want to do it right, if that's even something that's possible to do.

But that requires a certain level of anonymity, at least at first anyway, as projects like mine tend to be a magnet for all kinds of unsavory people and things. My actual identity will inevitibly get revealed at some point, but hopefully only after things are more solid. After all, once it's out there, it's out there - you no longer have any control over it.

Otherwise, I'm very open in real life about the fact that I'm an *animist*, and that I believe in the spirits of nature. Folks are usually pretty OK with that so long as I keep it general and stay away from specifics. Of course, like most people you wouldn't know unless you asked - I dress like a normal guy, drive a normal car, etc.

I feel that there are a lot of people like me out there, who have also had some sort of spiritual experience, and they're just waiting for the right time to start making moves. As I mentioned in my reply, I really do think that there's going to be a big religious revolution in the West relatively soon, centered around new religious movements, similar to what occured in post-war Japan. The new atheist movement of the 2000s and the post-modernism of the 2010s really left people starved of enchantment and rudderless from the lack of guidance. Things are very much not working anymore and people are growing tired of it.

[jprussell]

Very much agreed that our society is hungry for some kind of spirituality. If things follow the ~30 year cycle JMG has talked about, then we'd be due around 2040 or so for a cultural shift to spirituality, but I wouldn't be surprised at all to see rumblings and early signs well before that.

I've also gotten the sense that my own vague project might have some significance, but who knows if that's delusions of grandeur. For now, I'm focusing on deepening my own practice so that I have something to offer whenever I decide it's time to share.

Oh, and for what it's worth, I don't know if I'd characterize myself as an "animist," but I think that there's a lot to recommend an animist position, and I've tried to learn from animist traditions. I haven't done the deep dive on Shinto that I want to do just yet, but I suspect that it gives a window into a spiritual view of the world that's missing from most of the big Piscean religions.

Cheers,
Jeff

[causticus]

I like to say that I'm a Platonist when it comes to Heavenly things, and an Animist when it comes to the Earthly ;)

[alexanderthered]

That 30 year cycle feels about right to me. Do you have a link to a page where JMG writes about it? I'm very interested in reading about it.

After my failed attempts at connecting with neopagan groups, I made it my personal mission to absorb everything I could about the metaphysical, so I can learn how to interpret my experience (and hopefully the experiences of others) in a productive way.

And along the way, I have found so far, at least for me, anyway, precisely as you say - that the Piscean religions were deeply lacking what many animist / folk religions (eg Shinto, taoism, Chinese folk religion, etc) had. They're definitely worth looking in to IMO if you feel the need for a new perspective or some wisdom.

That being said, I think the Heathens have been putting in some serious work in making Heathenry it's own thing separate from the big neopagan tent, and it's really paid off in spades. There are still some challenges but I think Heathenry has got a bright future ahead of it.

[jprussell]

JMG's maybe talked about this in multiple places, but the one that comes most immediately to mind is: https://www.ecosophia.net/blogs-and-essays/the-well-of-galabes/the-twilight-of-the-neopagan-era/

That lays out the idea of the 30-year cycle, but again, there might be more detail elsewhere.

Hope this helps, and if not, let me know, and I can try to find some more relevant stuff.

Cheers,
Jeff

[alexanderthered]

Thanks for the link, it'll serve as a good jumping off point. I have only been following JMG for about a year so I don't know very much about his earlier writings. I have a lot to learn :)